Hoermann UAP1 - experience

[Aleq]

Hello Everybody.
For the owners of Hörmann garage doors with UAP1 module - does it work well for you? I have Supramatic 3E and UAP1 integrated into Loxone, but it's behaving very oddly. Simple commands UP when the doors are closed or DOWN when the doors are open work well and reliably. But using the Tr input (Garage/Gate controller) while the door is being closed does nothing at first. Second impulse stops the door motion. This leads to a strange state at this point. Any command sent will be interpreted as Up. So if I click Down in the visualization, the animation shows door closing but the doors actually go up.

So I wonder, how does the Hoermann garage doors work for you when integrated via UAP1? Is my wiring incorrect or is this normal behavior? It drives me nuts.

I'm having Qo and Qc linked to UAP1 up and UAP1 down only. I'm not using QTr.

Thanks for your time,
Aleq

[chrispie]

Hello Aleq,

I am using the UAP1 for more than 1 year and it is working very well. With the right setup in the LoxoneConfig it is also recognizing the movments caused by the heormann remote control. Attache my configuration (I hope the German is working for you. If not, just let me know.

The "Tor in Bewegung I4" Output must be changed in the UAP1 to "garage door in movment" to work with the Config above.

[Aleq]

Hi Chrispie,
thanks a lot for detailed instructions. I'll validate the wiring and loxone config setup against your documentation and screenshot. Thank you!

Have a nice day!
Aleq

[Doyanole]

Aleq Hey

Did you get it working with chrispie 's config ?

if yes , could you help me out a bit ? I'm kind of stuck a bit with the outcome.

Thanks

[Gast]

Hi chrispie

Thank you very much. I'm in the planning phase and want to use Hormann UAP1 as well.

Could you be so kind to validate the below understanding from a wiring point of view?
- UAP1 module is getting power through BUS cable connection from Hormann Supramatic itself? (Hormann Supramatic still connected to a power socket).
- For the 3 inputs I2, I3, I4 - one CAT7 cable (or SVV8x0,8) would be sufficient?
- For the 3 outputs Q5, Q6, Q7 - what kind of cable(s) would i need? Looks like 3 times 3G1,5 would do the trick?
- Would like to combine this engine with automatic fuse 6A from my screens. What kind of fuse is recommended?

Thank you

[chrispie]

Concerning your questions:

- UAP1 module is getting power through BUS cable connection from Hormann Supramatic itself? (Hormann Supramatic still connected to a power socket).
--> Correct.

- For the 3 inputs I2, I3, I4 - one CAT7 cable (or SVV8x0,8) would be sufficient?
- For the 3 outputs Q5, Q6, Q7 - what kind of cable(s) would i need? Looks like 3 times 3G1,5 would do the trick?

--> The important thing is that you need 12 wire in total. 6 from Loxone to UAP1 and 6 from UAP to Loxone. Non of the lines are bus signal and in my setup I use none as high voltage. So this is why I have used a 12 wire "telephone" cabel. My connetion distance between Loxone and UAP1 ist not very long. I guess it should do for longer distances, too, but I am not an electrician. CAT7 should do it too.


- Would like to combine this engine with automatic fuse 6A from my screens. What kind of fuse is recommended?
--> I am not an electrician. I can not answer this.

[Gast]

Hi chrispie ,

Thank you very much for your useful and very fast feedback!

With the Q5, Q6, Q7 being connected to Loxone relay output i was thinking it needed 230/240V (high voltage) but the Loxone relay output is acting here as a "signal switch" (not sure how to call this - so far only used Loxone Relay to switch 230V/high voltage outputs).

Based on what you are telling me this is not required. You just connected the 6 wires of Q5, Q6, Q7 directly on the Loxone Relay (outputs) without getting any line/high voltage from an automatic fuse (230V) or maybe power source (24V)?

If you could confirm, I'll probably then pull the following wires:
- 2 times CAT7 to avoid having to get another type of singal cable just for this short connection (for the 12 wires)
- 1 time XVB 5G1,5 (just to be future proof as future engines might just require the 4 wired approach over high voltage).

[chrispie]

You got it right. The Loxone relays for Q5,Q6,Q7 are acting as on/off switches, only. Connect the Loxone Relays to the UAP1, directly. No connection to any supply source 230V or 24V. The required power to detect on/off is supplied by the UAP1.

[Gast]

Thank you chrispie .

Your input has been very valuable for me. It seems sufficient for me to be confident about buying this UAP1.

Is there some configuration to be done on the Hormann Supramatic itself?
I'm looking at the manual of the Supramatic: http://www.hormann.be/fileadmin/_cou...3_DE-FR-NL.pdf
NOTE: For dutch (page 140), for french (page 94) and for german (page 46).

It is not clear to me whether you would need to go into the menu's and enable the functions of the UAP1.
With the average Hormann installer, I can imagine they don't typically have to install this UAP1 which comes down to: "you'll have to do it yourself after installation".

So in the scope of this topic with I2, I3, I4 and Q5, Q6, Q7 it would seem I could map:
- Menu 24: input about status door open (I3)
- Menu 25: input about status door closed (I2)

The others (I4, Q5, Q6, Q7) are - at least for me - not immediately clear to map.

So questions would be:
- Did you have to go into these menu's?
- If no: because your installer prepared it for you or is it default behavior if you just plug-in the UAP1 to the Supramatic?

[chrispie]

I remember that I had to change the relais output to "gate is moving" in the Hoerman Supramatic (I guess ist was menue point 29). May be the other I have set up as required, too. I am not sure because I have done it some time ago. The good thing with Loxone is, that you can test it step by step.

[Gast]

chrispie; ok thank you. Will give it a go in few months time

[Aleq]

Hello all,
thanks to extremely useful information from chrispie it's finally working for me. The key was to use 12-13 (chrispie's "Tor stopp Q6" for ref), because without it, Hörmann UAP1 does not react like Loxone Garage door controller. For instance, when the door is being opened and you press up, Loxone stops. UAP1 still continues. If the door is going down and you press up, Loxone stops, UAP1 changes direction and starts opening, etc. This had to be reset by opening closed 12-13 contact. In my first version I just linked this to the operation of Loxone door controller, whenever there was no output (up or down), 12-13 was open (which stopped but then kept blocking everything). This blocked the remote controls, so I changed this to Monoflop - a short opening of 12-13 contact is enough. This value needs to be shorther than Motor lock configuration value (otherwise it may block more then we need) and longer or equal than 0,3s as that proven as reliably recognizable by UAP1.

This is my simplified version:


All you need is
Loxone outputs:
- UAP1 command up (15-20, chrispie's Q5) - Q4 on my image
- UAP1 command down (17-20, chrispie's Q7) - Q2 on my image
- UAP1 enabled switch (12-13, chrispie's Q6) - Q7 on my image; doors are operational if this output is ON, door motion stop immediately and the door start ignoring any command when this output is OFF

Loxone inputs:
- UAP1 signaling the door is fully open (01, chrispie's I3) - AI3 on my image
- UAP2 signaling the door is fully closed (02, chrispie's I2) - AI2 on my image

Optional (not used by the control block):
- Supramatic Menu Item 29 configured providing AI4 (03, chrispie's I4 for ref): garage door in motion

Don't forget to set the Loxone Garage door control block to DIRECT Connection type (outputs steady on/off during operation, instead of default impulses) and make sure the Monoflop time is shorter than Motor lock.

Note: I'm using AIx (analog inputs) switched into digital mode becase I have ran out of digital ones. There is no other reason for this.

Thanks a lot chrispie.
Best regards,
Aleš

[challo]

Aleq Thanks for sharing your implementation. I installed UAP1 yesterday together with selfmade arduino UDP I/O Module. Now i'm controlling relay outputs and arduino inputs via UDP. It's working fine with your UAP implementation!

Also Thanks chrispie for your wiring. It's also working fine without any problems:-)

[Gast]

"Optional (not used by the control block):
- Supramatic Menu Item 29 configured providing AI4 (03, chrispie's I4 for ref): garage door in motion"

I can not find any information on this menu item in the manual. Is the "29" a page number, picture number, etc.
Could you please give some more directions? (e.g. copy the page that this info is on, and explain how to set it?)

[Aleq]

Settings option #29.

How to get to settings and how to change it is described in the attachment: SupraMatic_Series_3.pdf for instance, labeled as [21] in the document, by coincidence page 29. Settings item #29 (the number needs to be on the SupraMatic display) needs to be active (needs to have a dot there) in order to have UAP1 reporting garage door in motion. If you don't need that information, you can skip this complex step completely.