Loxone support for longtime customers: my story

[Gast]

Hello all,

I didn't do a lot yet on this forum, but I'm a loxone-user for quite some time now. I recently had to contact loxone-support because my installation went haywire when upgrading to version 9. I've always been a loxone-fan and I think I caused a few people to also buy it, even in a period, when here in Belgium at least, loxone was really unknown and some friends of mine, who also installed a domotica-system, didn't install it, because it was so unknown here and just getting it's feet of the ground (they went for a belgian-branded-system, which is less capable I think, but that's a side-note). At that time, there weren't a lot of electricians installing loxone, so, for the record, I did everything myself.

I started with my installation in 2013 when I could just get it from the Loxone Belgian distributor, who was selling it directly from his home at that time.

I've been a happy loxone-user for some years now, but recently I tried to upgrade to v9 (from 8.1) and it caused all my extensions to malfunction. Maybe I did something wrong, maybe there was something wrong in the v9-software. I didn't really know. The issue was that my home was totally offline, while I have small kids. When I couldn't really find the issue, I contact loxone-support...

I was quite happy that they called me the morning after with the remark that they normally don't call end customers ... Later on, which caused me to make this loxone-reply public, they told me should normally ask my loxone-installation-guy ..., I was wondering what they're doing with their longtime loxone-users, from the time when loxone still had a userforum, where the loxone-engineers replied directly. What's the support-policy for them? It's not that they don't know, they can determine the age of my miniserver by the serialnumber.

So, I'm actually fed up with them and actually regret going with loxone if this is the direction they're going. I'm happy I didn't link my heating with loxone. What if something goes wrong? I'll have to wait 3 days till I Get replacement-components, ...?

Well, here is the last response on my ticket of the loxone-support-guy and my reply towards him. For the record, I still can't decently upgrade my program to v9. I can upgrade it in loxone config, but when Iload it on the miniserver, I can't see the status of the miniserver. If I just load 8.3 or 8.1 onmy miniserver, everything works fine on the mainmodule atleast. I can also see the status of my extensions and my house almost works again, except for the relays not functioning. This is maybe I did wrong, or that went wrong during the upgrade to v9 (upgrade extension going wrong?). The thing is, they're support is not helpfull as longtime customer. What if I can't fix it, I just have to buy all the modules againf or the full price? We're talking about multiple 1000 €'s here...

Anyway, the conversation:

(the directions he's referring to are for the format of the loxone-sd-card, that I ordered from their store. I also asked if I could replace a fauly extension for a repair-cost instead of the full price, as my brother-in-law, who bought the system too because of me, was able to do some time ago. It's in dutch, but I'll translate it this evening. The German people should be able to alreadymake the most from it , I think…)


Beste Michel,

Ik heb je een opsomming gegeven van stappen die je moet uitvoeren. Gelieve deze dan ook te volgen.

Het is zeer ongebruikelijk dat wij u rechtstreeks aanspreken en deze hoeveelheid tijd investeren in een programmatie-/installatiefout van een eindklant. Normaal gesproken had u zich tot uw Loxone Installateur moeten wenden. Ik zou het dan ook erg op prijs stellen dat je onze adviezen volgt en instructies uitvoert. Anders heeft het geen zin dat ik tijd voor u vrij maak.

We hebben reeds uitgeklaard dat het probleem dat je ervaart ontstaan is door foutief gebruik en het het gebruiken van niet ondersteunde producten zoals de SD kaart die je in je miniserver hebt gestoken. Dit heb je aangegeven via telefoon en is je ook al eens verteld in voorgaande tickets.

Het beleid dat er ooit was waarin iedereen zomaar zijn extensies kon terugsturen is voorbij. Het zorgde voor onvoorzichtig gebruik van de producten aangezien Loxone toch maar alles bleef vervangen. Dit is dus geen optie meer en is gelukkig ook niet nodig. We merken dat mensen nu voorzichtiger zijn met de componenten en defecten zelden of nooit voorkomen, of er moest spraken zijn van blikseminslag of dergelijken.

Je bestelling wordt verstuurd vanuit de hoofdzetel in Oostenrijk en zal op de aangegeven datum worden bezorgd op het door u gekozen adres.

Wij zijn het meest verkochte systeem en marktleider in Europa. Elke minuut wordt er een server opgestart op V9. Moest er een fout zijn hadden wij deze seconden na de lancering al ontdekt. Voer de stappen uit zoals aangegeven op de website en in dit ticket. Het is ook best dat je een Loxone Installateur contacteert die je installatie volledig nakijkt en weer op punt stelt. Hij zal voor jou een logische programmatie maken en alle instellingen correct zetten.

[Gast]

For the record, my extensions (extension, dmx, ...) are continously flashing orange and are marked as "online" in loxone config and working as marked above. I just found this:

https://www.loxone.com/enen/kb/led-states/

It seems they're stuck in the "updating"-state, which may explain why the relays are not working in reality while loxone acts as if they're working. The support-guy could just have said that as I told him I believe that they're flashing orange. However, if I can't update them decently anymore, I apparently also can't send them in for repair..., if I have to believe what he told me, while it's only maybe the firmware that's wrong. I jsut have to buy new ones then ....

[Benjamin Jobst]

Hi Michel,

once again that reaction of Loxone staff shows me that Loxone has no clue which kind of customer they actually want to focus on. You bought your Loxone system while they tried to gather power users and you have a problem with your installation now they just want to talk to professionals any more... that's quite weird...

But actually your bigger problem is to get your Loxone installation back to life - the orange flashing basically means to me that the extensions have no program running at the moment - that usually occurs when you connect them to the Miniserver but you don't have the devices linked in the Config.
Have you already tried to load a backup of your last running configuration to the Miniserver? A backup should have been done before updating the Miniserver.
What has been the previous Firmware/Config version you've been working with? Maybe the gap between these two versions is too big?
What are the LEDs of the Miniserver doing? Maybe there is a problem with your SD card that occurred through the update process...?


Actually just a question: Why did you post this on the german part of the forum?

[Gast]

Hello Benny,

thanks for the info.

My biggest issue is indeed that they're doing as if supporting the endcustomer is not their job anymore and you have to be happy that they're helping you at all. Maybe I did something wrong, maybe there's something wrong in their update. I want a solution and prerably one that won't cost me 1000 of euro's (new installation), but a reparation-cost or just a software-one. I also understand that you don't have to come knocking on their door after every upgrade. However, it seems that they adjusted their policies to only focus on installers and no longer accept repairs.


Well, I thought I clicked the backup-option, but for one reason or the other, I can't find it... However, I have multiple versions of my configuration on a separate shared drive, so I have backups . I also made multiple backups in the meantime, while trying to upgrade/downgrade, ... to get out of this scenario. I know it sounds hectic and it was, if not a single light is working anymore ... The loxone-bus also gave a lot of errors suddenly after the upgrade, but that's back in order now. Not sure if it was v9, or the upgrade. I already tried to load a new old version 8.1/8.3 on the system and then it comes back to live as described below. Version 9 never does anything. The miniserver runs on v9, but my configuration won't run, although it loads it and the admin-user still has the default password, although my config is loaded. Anyway, I'm staying at v8 for now. That version, atleast some to work fully on my miniserver. Only my extension have the bad behaviour described below. My relay-extension is currently completely dead. The latter is maybe on my part, but I'm not sure (mayeb I pulled the power too quickly when v9 was loaded, but as I mentionned v9 acted very weird). I already order a new relay-extension from loxone as a I can't really wait on support. I was hoping for a repair at least as it's my first issue with my installation (except for a fauly loxone-sdcard), but that doesn't seem possible anymore.

So, the other extensions:

Well, the devices are linked in the config and are showing as "online", but they're still flashing orange. I also can see the values on the extensions and control the relays, but the relays don't do anything in reality.

I thought I posted ont he English forum. My apologies if I submitted it to the wrong section after all. Please move it, if possible.

[Benjamin Jobst]

Hm this does indeed not soud very encouraging...
But actually you perfectly managed to confuse me - I assume your whole Loxone system still is not working except for the miniserver doing its job without any physical actions?
- Which firmware version is running on your extensions, if they are displayed as online there should be a current FW version displayed?
- When you are connected to your MS, can you search for extensions and you get all your devices as a result?
- Do you have IOs on your Miniserver itself in action? Do these work properly?

So to have some structure here is what I would recommend (maybe you already have done exatly this but I can't be sure depending on your answer and as you already said it might have been a bit too hectic and you may have forgotten one or the other step...)
- in case you have a connection to your Miniserver via the Config, the MS has a firmware for v8 running - restored by a previous backup AND you have a quite recent version of your Config file which is based on this firmware version
=> check if all your extensions are correctly linked in the Config Hardware configuration - that usually just depends on the serial number of the device
==>connect to your Miniserver and write this Config to your miniserver - by this all extensions sould receive a version of the program they are expected to run

Another idea worth trying would be assigning all extensions once again to their virtual pendant in the config. As I said to me this sounds like the extensions forgot their tasks... When they can be found as online the Loxbus itself should be more or less alright...